Stretching Strategy

Ursomniac

Member
So I've reprocessed all of my images from my Unistellar eQuinox 2 and (the few I have so far) my Seestar S50.

Overall I'm really pleased. But in churning through all the different objects, and using the experience to get adept at PixInsight (honestly, it's not nearly as hard as some people make it out to be), I find myself uncertain about "the right way" to approach stretching.

The tutorlals I read have you do the Histogram Transformation with the Screen Transfer Function, and after that use Arcsinh stretch to clean up:

1. Hit the "fallout shelter" button on the STF popup, then apply it to the HT.
2. Futz with the Shadows/Midtones values to get (something that's supposed to be what you want) and save.
3. Go into the Arcsinh Stretch to clean up.

... and that works. BUT: :)

a. When you get the STF application, there's always cruft, noise, background that you want to remove. At the same time you want to get a good contrast profile of your DSO (or for things like nebula capture the faintest parts without dragging in the background).

b. So that means futzing. What I can't quite figure out is this:

1. Should you futz with Midtones first and THEN Shadows, or the other way around?
2. Either way - if you're going to go to Arcsinh afterwards, what should you be trying to achieve before that step? In other words, how much "cruft" should you be attempting to get rid of in this first stretch pass?
2a. Sometimes I've gone for "get rid of as much cruft as possible" but then the Arcsinh black point is really 0.0 or very close to it, so that seems to make it not very effective.
2b. Sometimes I've done the midtones first to remove cruft and then shadows to bring out the object just until I start to get background.
2c. Sometimes I've done shadows first, let the background be bright and somewhat uniform then use midtones to bring it back down
2d. Sometimes I've saved things with a non-black, but somewhat uniform background and then let Arcsinh use a higher black point.

No matter which of those I do, I get "something" but I'm always wondering if I'm just poking arbitrarily, unaware there's a "right/better/more consistent" way to approach it. Of course it's unlikely that a single strategy will work for EVERYTHING, but I'd like to be more consistent on approach and "master" the process wisely.

So - any advice would be greatly appreciated. :)

(Another issue is that I'll get things looking nicely on my Mac with the great internal monitor and if I drag an image to my ex-TV-lets-use-it-as-a-second monitor, background artifacts reappear and things generally look crappier. I mean I know WHY (the ex-Tv just isn't as nice), but if there are ways to improve the stretching/cleaning up to mitigate that - all the better!)
 
So I've reprocessed all of my images from my Unistellar eQuinox 2 and (the few I have so far) my Seestar S50.

Overall I'm really pleased. But in churning through all the different objects, and using the experience to get adept at PixInsight (honestly, it's not nearly as hard as some people make it out to be), I find myself uncertain about "the right way" to approach stretching.

The tutorlals I read have you do the Histogram Transformation with the Screen Transfer Function, and after that use Arcsinh stretch to clean up:

1. Hit the "fallout shelter" button on the STF popup, then apply it to the HT.
2. Futz with the Shadows/Midtones values to get (something that's supposed to be what you want) and save.
3. Go into the Arcsinh Stretch to clean up.

... and that works. BUT: :)

a. When you get the STF application, there's always cruft, noise, background that you want to remove. At the same time you want to get a good contrast profile of your DSO (or for things like nebula capture the faintest parts without dragging in the background).

b. So that means futzing. What I can't quite figure out is this:

1. Should you futz with Midtones first and THEN Shadows, or the other way around?
2. Either way - if you're going to go to Arcsinh afterwards, what should you be trying to achieve before that step? In other words, how much "cruft" should you be attempting to get rid of in this first stretch pass?
2a. Sometimes I've gone for "get rid of as much cruft as possible" but then the Arcsinh black point is really 0.0 or very close to it, so that seems to make it not very effective.
2b. Sometimes I've done the midtones first to remove cruft and then shadows to bring out the object just until I start to get background.
2c. Sometimes I've done shadows first, let the background be bright and somewhat uniform then use midtones to bring it back down
2d. Sometimes I've saved things with a non-black, but somewhat uniform background and then let Arcsinh use a higher black point.

No matter which of those I do, I get "something" but I'm always wondering if I'm just poking arbitrarily, unaware there's a "right/better/more consistent" way to approach it. Of course it's unlikely that a single strategy will work for EVERYTHING, but I'd like to be more consistent on approach and "master" the process wisely.

So - any advice would be greatly appreciated. :)

(Another issue is that I'll get things looking nicely on my Mac with the great internal monitor and if I drag an image to my ex-TV-lets-use-it-as-a-second monitor, background artifacts reappear and things generally look crappier. I mean I know WHY (the ex-Tv just isn't as nice), but if there are ways to improve the stretching/cleaning up to mitigate that - all the better!)
I think that most people would agree that the most powerful tool for stretching, in most cases (there are always exceptions, of course), is GHS (a free, third-party add-in process and script). Using it effectively definitely has a significant learning curve, but there are lots of good tutorials out there.

If I don't use GHS, I use HT. Only. I don't find tools like ArcsinhStretch to be useful for most processing. In HT I usually get the results I like in about three passes. I never transfer a STF to HT or use STF for anything other than getting a usable screen view. As most images have at least a few saturated stars in them, I don't normally touch the high end slider. Step one I pull the midtone slider way down to the upper edge of the histogram. Step two I bring the shadows slider up to just below where the first signal pixels start to clip (I say it this way because I always work on uncropped images, so a black border may be present and represented in the histogram... easy to ignore) and then bring the midrange down a bit more until the background starts showing again. Step three I tweak the background and midrange, usually just a small amount, to get as much signal as I can and keep the background just above the noise floor.
 
I think that most people would agree that the most powerful tool for stretching, in most cases (there are always exceptions, of course), is GHS (a free, third-party add-in process and script). Using it effectively definitely has a significant learning curve, but there are lots of good tutorials out there.

If I don't use GHS, I use HT. Only. I don't find tools like ArcsinhStretch to be useful for most processing. In HT I usually get the results I like in about three passes. I never transfer a STF to HT or use STF for anything other than getting a usable screen view. As most images have at least a few saturated stars in them, I don't normally touch the high end slider. Step one I pull the midtone slider way down to the upper edge of the histogram. Step two I bring the shadows slider up to just below where the first signal pixels start to clip (I say it this way because I always work on uncropped images, so a black border may be present and represented in the histogram... easy to ignore) and then bring the midrange down a bit more until the background starts showing again. Step three I tweak the background and midrange, usually just a small amount, to get as much signal as I can and keep the background just above the noise floor.
OK - lemme look into GHS! Thanks.
 
All of the options described above have one thing in common - they apply a selected stretch function (an MTF for HT; ArcSinh; various options for GHS), but usually this is not what I want. I often want to pull out detail from two or three specific regions. I can use statistics on previews to find the range of values in these regions. Then I want to define a multi-step stretch specifically stretching these ranges of values. The tool for this is CurvesTransformation. I hardly ever use any other stretch tool.
 
I often want to pull out detail from two or three specific regions. I can use statistics on previews to find the range of values in these regions. Then I want to define a multi-step stretch specifically stretching these ranges of values. The tool for this is CurvesTransformation. I hardly ever use any other stretch tool.
Very targeted stretching is something GHS excels at as well. The downside to that (for me at least) is if you’re shooting Lum, I find matching the Lum stretch to the RGB stretch before combining can be a challenge, especially for complex targets like nebulae. So, I stretch RGB first, then create a luminance from it and use that to match the Lum stretch to.

On occasion, though not very often, if color seems weak with GHS even in Colour mode, I’ll do an intial light stretch with Arcsinh. It seems to preserve (enhance?) color more than any other stretch. Then I continue with GHS.

Cheers,
Scott
 
Very targeted stretching is something GHS excels at as well.
GHS is good at targetting a single stretching target range. Repeated application of GHS can stretch multiple ranges, but this has problems; you often "run out of" stretch space and have to iterate. CurvesTransformation can produce targetted custom mutiple range stretches in a single step.
 
Have to admit, I've never used CT for stretching other than an occasional tweak after doing most of it with GHS (or Arcsinh/HT before), but I'll have give it a try. You're right about the 'space' issue.

Cheers,
Scott
 
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