Author Topic: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?  (Read 91856 times)

Offline georg.viehoever

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #75 on: 2010 June 13 05:20:46 »
Here a test on "virtual" hardware rented at Amazon EC2. This appears to be a good approach if you temporarily need a machine with huge RAM. Graphics Performance via Remote Desktop seems to be acceptable.

Version 01.06.00.0592 eng(x86_64) on Amazon EC2 Windows Server 2008 on m1.large instance (according to Windows, that an "Intel Xeon E5430 @2.66GHz 2,.8 GHz (2 processors), 7.5 GBtyes RAM", whatever this means in a virtual environment):
New Icons (Benchmark_M74_parallel.psm): 17.1 secs
Old Icons (Benchmark_M74.psm): 46.38 secs


Georg
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Offline georg.viehoever

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #76 on: 2010 June 13 06:23:40 »
Same scenario as in previous message, but this time with instance of type c1.xlarge (for compute intense tasks, Intel E5410@2.33 GHz 2.46 GHz (8 processors), 7 GBytes of RAM):

New Icons (Benchmark_M74_parallel.psm): 11.9 secs
Old Icons (Benchmark_M74.psm): 45.19 secs

Since this is 1,16 USD per hour (compared to 0,48 USD per hour for m1.large), it does not really pay off.

Georg
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Offline Niall Saunders

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #77 on: 2010 June 13 08:39:06 »
How does this work Georg?

Presumably you rent 'time' on a remote server, and can upload (i.e. 'install') software on the 'virtual machine' for the duration of your session? And, at the end of the session, your entire 'virtual image' is then deleted?

Seems like an interesting idea - but I can't see how financially viable it is. And, the end results did not seem to outshine a 'moderate' home PC (considering what is available nowadays). Still - if you have the bandwidth to be able to upload your raw data, and the software needed to process it, then it might be feasible. But, it isn't the same at 'hearing' your very own processor grind through a task in a box down by your feet ;D

Cheers,
Cheers,
Niall Saunders
Clinterty Observatories
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Offline bitli

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #78 on: 2010 June 13 08:46:31 »
Hmmm, may be this could solve one of my problems.

I wanted to demo PI at my club, but I have no reasonable portable computer anymore. So maybe I can setup a 'server' and use it for the demo and examples. I just need to send the raw images one on the server, so this would not be a problem.

My understanding is that as long as I protect the license and I am the only one able to use it, this should be ok. Juan ?

I could digg it up, but if you have some step by step on how to set it up, I would gladly follow them :-)

-- bitli

Offline georg.viehoever

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #79 on: 2010 June 13 09:08:08 »
Hi Niall,

How does this work Georg?

Basically, you rent CPU time, storage and network capacity from Amazon on a on-demand basis, see http://aws.amazon.com/de/ec2/ (I hope they switch to english with an english language browser... I always get the german language page). Prices are quite reasonable http://aws.amazon.com/de/ec2/pricing/, at around 0.50 $/hour CPU and 0.10 $/GByte/month storage. So you can buy quite a lot of processing time for the 2000 USD that an upper end computer costs these days. With the Windows Remote Desktop integration with the remote machine is almost seemless, you can even map your local drives to the remote computer. The details of setting up such a machine on the Amazon side are a bit complicated, but can be done in an hour or two.

For me, this may be a solution
- if I need a large RAM machine (you can get up to 68 GBytes of RAM, albeit more expensive than the basic machine)
- if I am traveling with a small netbook and still want to do image processing with reasonable speed.

It may even be possible to connect via iPhone, all you need is an RDP client (http://itunes.apple.com/de/app/remote-desktop-lite/id288362576?mt=8, or http://itap.mobi/itap-rdp not tested yet...)  8)

For the Linux fans: yes, it is also possible to run Linux (not tested yet).

Georg


« Last Edit: 2010 June 13 09:28:07 by georg.viehoever »
Georg (6 inch Newton, unmodified Canon EOS40D+80D, unguided EQ5 mount)

Offline georg.viehoever

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #80 on: 2010 June 13 09:13:14 »
Bitli,
Hmmm, may be this could solve one of my problems.

I wanted to demo PI at my club, but I have no reasonable portable computer anymore. So maybe I can setup a 'server' and use it for the demo and examples. I just need to send the raw images one on the server, so this would not be a problem.
...

If you know how to open a few ports on your internet router, this is indeed a way to do it. Since only the "Professsional" Windows versions allow to connect via RDP, VNC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_Network_Computing might be an option. Of course, you can also go the Amazon EC2 way if you are willing to spend a few dollars.

Georg
Georg (6 inch Newton, unmodified Canon EOS40D+80D, unguided EQ5 mount)

Offline Niall Saunders

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #81 on: 2010 June 13 23:38:35 »
Hi Bitli

Quote
I wanted to demo PI at my club, but I have no reasonable portable computer anymore. So maybe I can setup a 'server' and use it for the demo and examples. I just need to send the raw images one on the server, so this would not be a problem

Have you looked at TeamViewer?

This is a free package (for non-commercial use) and it JUST WORKS !!

You really don't need any 'techie' knowledge to set it up either - it will work right across the 'Net and through your firewalls without any hassle. I even use it now if I want to come back in from the Observatory of an evening. It is also my preferred choice for offering 'remote assistance' simply because it is so easy for a novice to set up the remote end.

Drop me a line if you want more information - or download the software and get in touch with me to see the system working 'for real'.

Cheers,
Cheers,
Niall Saunders
Clinterty Observatories
Aberdeen, UK

Altair Astro GSO 10" f/8 Ritchey Chrétien CF OTA on EQ8 mount with homebrew 3D Balance and Pier
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Offline georg.viehoever

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #82 on: 2010 July 06 01:48:33 »
Hi,
Here a test on "virtual" hardware rented at Amazon EC2. This appears to be a good approach if you temporarily need a machine with huge RAM. Graphics Performance via Remote Desktop seems to be acceptable.
...

For those interested in something like this: Here is my bill for June, basically the costs for having 2 short PI  sessions plus 1 month of 30 GB storage on EC2: $4.59+VAT
Code: [Select]
EU (Ireland) Region
  Amazon EC2 running Windows  
    $0.48 per Large Windows Instance (m1.large) instance-hour (or partial hour)  2 Hrs  0.96  
    $1.16 per High-CPU Extra Large Windows Instance (c1.xlarge) instance-hour (or partial hour)  1 Hrs  1.16  
  Amazon EC2 EBS  
    $0.11 per GB-month of provisioned storage  17.542 GB-Mo  1.93  
    $0.11 per 1 million I/O requests  247402 IOs  0.03  
    $0.15 per GB-Month of snapshot data stored  3.237 GB-Mo  0.49  
    $0.010 per 10,000 gets (when loading a snapshot)  3196 Requests  0.01  
    $0.010 per 1,000 puts (when saving a snapshot)  15 Requests  0.01  
 »  4.59  

I find this quite acceptable. Note that I did not do any lengthy sessions last month, so as an intense user, you will get higher bills.

Georg
« Last Edit: 2010 July 06 13:09:20 by georg.viehoever »
Georg (6 inch Newton, unmodified Canon EOS40D+80D, unguided EQ5 mount)

Offline Nocturnal

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #83 on: 2010 July 21 12:54:35 »
I find it interesting that Juan hasn't jumped in here with some kind of explanation why the console has such an effect on performance. Especially because some time ago there were some suggestions to get rid of the thing and of course that never happened :)

In 1.6 I don't see how to delay the processing console from popping up. I do notice that every item in the process container causes the application to 'flash'. It should probably only flash when the entire process container is done.

Results:

Laptop with Centrino Duo @ 1.6G, 2.5GB RAM, WinXP 32b: 25s.
Desktop with i7-920 and Vista x64: 7.5s
Best,

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Offline Nocturnal

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #84 on: 2010 July 21 13:17:25 »
Hmm, I wonder why the 'undo' operation takes so long after applying the process container. I would expect this to be near instantaneous but it takes several seconds.

Also, when I restrict PI to only 1 (out of 2) cores on my laptop the time goes to 42s so that's about in-line with expectations. I first reported 164 seconds but I had forgotten that I had increased the image size x2 :) Oops!
« Last Edit: 2010 July 21 13:22:39 by Nocturnal »
Best,

    Sander
---
Edge HD 1100
QHY-8 for imaging, IMG0H mono for guiding, video cameras for occulations
ASI224, QHY5L-IIc
HyperStar3
WO-M110ED+FR-III/TRF-2008
Takahashi EM-400
PIxInsight, DeepSkyStacker, PHD, Nebulosity

Offline Carlos Milovic

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #85 on: 2010 September 26 16:44:48 »
How are going things in this topic these days? I want to upgrade my computer... nearly US$700 of bugdet for processor, mainboard, HDD and RAM (anything else? maybe a new tower...) I've got 2 19" monitor that I would like to use. Suggestions?

BTW, I'm more a fan of AMD products than Intel...
Regards,

Carlos Milovic F.
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Offline Nigel Ball

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #86 on: 2010 September 27 02:13:31 »
Carlos

There is another thread on a similar topic which might interest you http://pixinsight.com/forum/index.php?topic=2375.0

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Offline Niall Saunders

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #87 on: 2010 September 27 14:13:36 »
Quote
I want to upgrade my computer... nearly US$700 of bugdet

Carlos - you are going to have to set aside part of that budget just to keep the Dark Side supplied with cookies :P
Cheers,
Niall Saunders
Clinterty Observatories
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Offline Carlos Milovic

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #88 on: 2010 September 27 15:10:28 »
Cookies are supplied by the boss, and are next to the beers ;)
Regards,

Carlos Milovic F.
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Offline Niall Saunders

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Re: New PC: biggest bang for the buck?
« Reply #89 on: 2010 September 27 15:16:01 »
Hola Juan,

Dos cervesas es dos cookies, por favor ;D
Cheers,
Niall Saunders
Clinterty Observatories
Aberdeen, UK

Altair Astro GSO 10" f/8 Ritchey Chrétien CF OTA on EQ8 mount with homebrew 3D Balance and Pier
Moonfish ED80 APO & Celestron Omni XLT 120
QHY10 CCD & QHY5L-II Colour
9mm TS-OAG and Meade DSI-IIC