Author Topic: Manual White Balance  (Read 5000 times)

Offline blinky

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
Manual White Balance
« on: 2012 September 02 07:18:07 »
I had a thought that if I took one of my Flats images and then changed the white balance (within the assisted color calibration function) sliders so that the image was a uniform grey, I could apply these white balance settings to my stacked images and I should then have something approaching a neutral color balance.
So..... I opened the assisted colour cabibration function, did as above and got the figures:
RED:1.757
GREEN:0.713
BLUE:0.722

I then with a real smug smile on my face, opened one of my image stacks and then opened the 'Color Calibration' function ;), my plan all fell apart though, as the white balance sliders in this section dont go above 1 :(  Why dont they go above 1, why have an assisted color calibration function that allows you to go above 1??

Offline Philip de Louraille

  • PixInsight Addict
  • ***
  • Posts: 289
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #1 on: 2012 September 02 07:43:33 »
Normalize them all by dividing by the higher value.

red = 1.757/1.757 = 1.000
green = 0.713/1.757 = 0.406
blue = 0.722/1.757 = 0.411
Philip de Louraille

Offline blinky

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #2 on: 2012 September 02 07:50:26 »
OK, I tried that but for some reason it only makes the stacked image redder? I am not sure whats going on with it but if I do the same with theoriginal flat it does indeed make it a uniform grey. I am wondering if something went wrong when stacking the image as it does seem to be very red but the flats are lacking in red due to my light pollution filter.

Offline blinky

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #3 on: 2012 September 02 07:55:20 »
Philip - Is my thinking correct, that if I get the correct color balance in a flat I should be able to apply it to a light frame? If I do that it just makes it way too red :-\

Offline Philip de Louraille

  • PixInsight Addict
  • ***
  • Posts: 289
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #4 on: 2012 September 02 08:13:39 »
Clearly, with these numbers:
RED:1.757
GREEN:0.713
BLUE:0.722
you have a huge bias toward the red. I'd remove that light pollution filter  and redo the experiment. Such filters are designed to improve the visibility of a variety of Deep-Sky objects by blocking out the common Mercury vapor, Sodium, and some other emission lines from man-made or natural sources which contribute to light pollution, while letting through a broad range of other more useful wavelengths.
So taking a picture of the sky versus taking a picture of a screen inside your dome are not equivalent at all.
Philip de Louraille

Offline blinky

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #5 on: 2012 September 02 08:14:54 »
But the image of the imside of the dome was taken with the same filter in place, should this not mean both images need the same white balance applied to them?

Offline Philip de Louraille

  • PixInsight Addict
  • ***
  • Posts: 289
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #6 on: 2012 September 02 08:52:45 »
I don't think so. Your filter is not "neutral" per say, it plays an active role: it lets more red light in (for ionized hydrogen) and blocks others (it is a mix of broad band pass and and some narrow band blocking.) Your light inside your dome and the reflection off your screen do not recreate a valid sky light and this is what the filter is designed for.
A flat is designed to correct optical defects due to dust in the FOV (camera, mirrors, eyepiece, ...)
Your idea of using a flat to correct a color balance of your CCD chip assumes that you are using a light that emits the same intensities in the RGB and then that your screen will reflect those with the same ratios.
So even without the sky filter, I think that using a flat to get an idea of your camera color bias will give you a "first order" idea.
Retake the flats without the filter, get the color correction and apply them to "normal" pictures (street, people, nature, ...) and see if you can truly get a white-balance correction that way.
You can also take these pictures while placing a grey square in the field of view and see what color corrections you need to apply to the grey square.
Philip de Louraille

Offline astroedo

  • PixInsight Addict
  • ***
  • Posts: 171
  • Io ne ho viste... cose che voi umani...
    • L'arciere celeste
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #7 on: 2012 September 04 01:22:58 »
Philip - Is my thinking correct, that if I get the correct color balance in a flat I should be able to apply it to a light frame? If I do that it just makes it way too red :-\

No this is not correct:
during  your stack calibration you divide your light frames by your flat.
observing your numbers your flat appears very blue (are you using a CLS filter or a LED flatbox?).
Dividing your light by your flat you get a very red image, and applying your color calibration you turns even redder.
Probably if you try using reciprocal of your calibration numbers you get something better.

Try
R: 0.4058
G: 1
B: 0.9875

Offline blinky

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
Re: Manual White Balance
« Reply #8 on: 2012 September 20 12:41:15 »
Ah, that makes a bit of sense! And yes I'm using a LPS filter