Author Topic: Help with 'light leak'?  (Read 10964 times)

Offline Josh Lake

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Help with 'light leak'?
« on: 2011 January 30 09:56:24 »
Can anyone help me identify this issue with my CCD so I can correct it?

Recently, I've noticed a gradient that looks like a light leak in the corner of my frames. I've been able to handle it with processing, but of course I'd rather just fix the actual problem.

It shows up on light frames.
It doesn't show up on Bias or Dark frames.
My dome is dark, with all lights in the obs either shut off or covered with electrical tape (so many LEDs!).

It's an SBIG STL-11000 on a Tak FSQ-106 (what a combo!).

Here's a link to how it looks (2x2 binning):

Raw file -- http://db.tt/0xWYisl

After calibration with bias and dark -- http://db.tt/sA132dD

Here are links to the FIT files themselves, if that would help:

http://db.tt/RwNvaqD

Thanks for any, well, insights you might all have.

Offline sigurd

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #1 on: 2011 January 30 10:41:21 »
Is it in the light frame for every target?

-esy
”My punctuality is well known. When The Revolution takes place, I'll be late, and I'll be shot as a traitor.”

Offline Josh Lake

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #2 on: 2011 January 30 13:18:45 »
Unfortunately: http://db.tt/HrASE0z
 :(

Offline Nigel Ball

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #3 on: 2011 January 30 14:48:09 »
I have the same combo STL-11000 and FSQ106

I have light areas in the bottom left and bottom right of my subs at the moment after flat/dark/bias calibration!

They are not as bright as yours but there nevertheless - the more subs I stack the brighter they are

I know this doesn't help your situation but you are not alone ....
Nigel Ball
Nantwich, Cheshire, United Kingdom

Takahashi FSQ-106 at f/8, f/5 and f/3.6 on AP900, Nikon 28 mm and 180mm f/2.8
SBIG STL-11000M, Astrodon LRGB, 5nm Ha
ST-10XME, Astrodon HaLRGB
www.nigelaball.com

Offline sigurd

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #4 on: 2011 January 30 14:57:06 »
Not to be pedantic, but it might be usefully confirmatory to try in a completely different part of the sky.  ;)

-esy
”My punctuality is well known. When The Revolution takes place, I'll be late, and I'll be shot as a traitor.”

Offline Josh Lake

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #5 on: 2011 January 31 04:38:33 »

Is M45 far enough away? http://db.tt/vy1TiQ6

I think we can all agree that it's definitely not stellar, right? I just wanted to see if anyone had this kind of thing happen to them... I want to try to narrow it down. Is it light coming into the scope? Is it inside the camera somehow? If it was something with the chip, I think it'd show up in my darks.

 ???

Offline vicent_peris

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #6 on: 2011 January 31 04:46:52 »
Hi,

this is typical from an amplifier glow... I have the same in a FLI PL16803. I must find how to correct it... hope we will have an option in PI to correct amp glows in a near future. :)


Regards,
V.

Offline zvrastil

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #7 on: 2011 January 31 05:02:48 »
Hi,

if it's not on the dark frames, it can't be amplifier glow, can be? I have amplifier glow as well on my poor old Canon 300D, but if I use dark frames of proper temperature, it is removed almost completely.

It should be easy to confirm if it comes from scope or camera - just try to take several shots with different orientation of the camera.

regards, Zbynek


Offline Josh Lake

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #8 on: 2011 January 31 05:38:20 »

These shots (well, the M45 and the M42, at least), were at different rotations, so it must be the camera, right?

And you know what? I was wrong, it is in the darks -- I just hadn't done a screen transfer, so I never looked at how bright it is on the darks. It is BRIGHT.

http://db.tt/JMV4oLt

So, amplifier glow? That doesn't sound good. Any ideas?

Offline sigurd

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #9 on: 2011 January 31 07:19:02 »
If it's in the darks as well, it's amplifier glow. Should be removable with a good dark set.

-esy
”My punctuality is well known. When The Revolution takes place, I'll be late, and I'll be shot as a traitor.”

Offline Josh Lake

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #10 on: 2011 January 31 19:08:27 »
Fair enough, but I'd of course love to remove it before it gets on my chip! I found this in the SBIG driver documentation:

 For the ST-7/ST-8/ST-9/ST-10/ST-1K/ST-402 add START_SKIP_VDD to the ccd parameter to
increase the image rep rate. This bypasses the time consuming reduction of the CCD’s Vdd
which is normally used to reduce the readout amplifier glow for the imaging CCD.  You’ll get a
glow in the upper-left corner of the Imaging CCD but the readout rep rate will be higher.  SBIG
uses this in the Turbo focus mode.

I'm using Maxim to expose -- perhaps it relates to their 'fast readout' mode? I'll experiment.

Thanks for the insights, all.

Offline sigurd

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #11 on: 2011 February 01 15:12:09 »
I think you are misunderstanding. It's not a light leak in the sense you are thinking. there isn't some path for light to get to your chip (like a hole or gap in your telescope tube or anything).

Amplifier glow is heat being given off by some electrical component in your camera itself (usually an amplifier). That heat is EM radiation just like light, and CCDs being sensitive to it, you get a glow/gradient from the area closest to the source. A very well designed astronomical camera really shouldn't exhibit amplifier glow as it is indicative of "questionable" amplifier placement, shielding, or choice of electronic component. As noted in their documentation, it is entirely possible that it could be caused by a "fast" readout mode. I think you may be disappointed with how slow their "normal readout mode speed is though.

Fortunately, that glow should be fairly predictable, and can usually be removed through the subtraction of good bias and/or dark frames. I seem to recall this glow is one-shot (i.e. from reading) and hence removable with bias.

Let us know how you make out. You should be able to experiment with bias/dark frames and "light" frames during the day, and not have to waste precious imaging time. You might want to start by taking a bias frame, taking a dark frame, and then subtracting the bias from the dark. That should give you a good indication of where you stand.

-esy
”My punctuality is well known. When The Revolution takes place, I'll be late, and I'll be shot as a traitor.”

Offline Josh Lake

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #12 on: 2011 February 03 12:40:00 »
Sure enough, the culprit was Normal vs. Fast readout mode in Maxim DL: http://db.tt/Vbj5jWX

So does anyone know what, physically, this is all about? Does the faster readout mode heat up the corner of the chip and create this glow? I'm going to avoid it from now on, of course, unless someone knows of a way to deal with it at the hardware level or with software.

Sigurd, you're right, I can deal with this with calibration, but I'd rather not add noise -- even to a corner -- if I can avoid it...

Offline sigurd

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #13 on: 2011 February 03 13:47:55 »
My guess is the faster readout mode produces more heat.

-esy
”My punctuality is well known. When The Revolution takes place, I'll be late, and I'll be shot as a traitor.”

Offline pfile

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Re: Help with 'light leak'?
« Reply #14 on: 2011 February 03 16:46:26 »
maybe this is applicable... looks like the bits all converge on the corner. the transistors there probably get hot as most of the image passes thru them.

http://learn.hamamatsu.com/articles/interline.html