Author Topic: Couple things  (Read 2914 times)

Offline Warhen

  • PTeam Member
  • PixInsight Old Hand
  • ****
  • Posts: 490
    • Billions and Billions
Couple things
« on: 2012 October 29 20:57:57 »
Hi guys,
             Can anyone make a 'layman's' comparison of the Lanczos-3 registration algorithm to CCDStack's Nearest Neighbor for me? Are they similar mathematically? Both seem to be highly touted.

On another note, Vicent talks about not sweating the duration and temp variations as Bias scaling is done so well in PI. I'm aware and have documented the 'Exp time' variation setting in BPP, but how much temp variation is advisable?

And while Bias scaling back a 30m Dark to a 15m Light is commonly done in PI and other software, what are the feelings about scaling up a shorter Dark to a longer Light?

Thanks guys!
Best always, Warren

Warren A. Keller
www.ip4ap.com

Offline Carlos Milovic

  • PTeam Member
  • PixInsight Jedi Master
  • ******
  • Posts: 2172
  • Join the dark side... we have cookies
    • http://www.astrophoto.cl
Re: Couple things
« Reply #1 on: 2012 October 29 21:19:26 »
They are interpolation algorithms. When you register images, you end up with noninteger displacements. So, if you had a sequence:
12 52 8 6 10 15
and you want to know the value at the "coordinate" 2.3 (for example, starting from position 1), you have to use an interpolation algorithm to know this value.
The nearest neighbour algorithm just looks for the integer valued pixel that is closest to the desired location. In this example, 52.
The linear interpolation algorithm is a more "clever" way to get the desired value. Just averages the values of the closest neighbours, depending of the distance. In this case: 0.7*52+0.3*8
There are much more sophisticated ways to guess what is the "real" value in the continuous range. One of them is the Lanczos-3. Another are the splines. They generally assume that there are certain functions that models how the pixel vary, and the pixel values at the integer positions give you the amplitude of those functions. Then, you just evaluate the functions at any desired location. Roughly, different function models assume different behaviours of the underlying signal. Some of them tries to generate smooth images; others to preserve sharp edges, etc.
The nearest neighbour algorithm is the simplest and faster of these algorithm, but also most of the times is the one that yields poorer results. It does preserve well edges, and a sence of sharpness of the image, but at the expense of creating artifacts, and distorting shapes or objects.
Regards,

Carlos Milovic F.
--------------------------------
PixInsight Project Developer
http://www.pixinsight.com

Offline Warhen

  • PTeam Member
  • PixInsight Old Hand
  • ****
  • Posts: 490
    • Billions and Billions
Re: Couple things
« Reply #2 on: 2012 October 29 22:08:57 »
god bless math guys like you Carlos- thank you! So, NN is quite inferior at least with regard to  the smoothest, astifact-free result.

On my other question, I just found this from Juan 'As Rob has said, our dark frame optimization routine finds the scaling factors that minimize noise in the calibrated frames. It is a purely numerical solution that ignores exposure times, temperatures, etc, because it does not need them: it works exclusively with the pixel data.' That is amazing.

Thanks Pixies
Best always, Warren

Warren A. Keller
www.ip4ap.com

Offline pfile

  • PTeam Member
  • PixInsight Jedi Grand Master
  • ********
  • Posts: 4729
Re: Couple things
« Reply #3 on: 2012 October 29 22:42:21 »
i think some years back now i posted a question about the dark scaling - with very long exposures and correspondingly long darks, the dark scaling algorithm was (correctly) minimizing the noise in the target frame, but the hot pixels were being oversubtracted, leaving cold 'holes' in my image.

the image in question was a very widefield image with no dithering, so the cold pixels were a bit of a problem.

DefectMap could have fixed me up probably but i'm not sure if it existed then.

so i guess there are corner cases where the dark scaling routines can leave you with artifacts, but they are probably easily overcome.

there are new dark scaling algorithms coming in 1.8, right?

rob