Author Topic: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach  (Read 6659 times)

Offline aworonow

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #15 on: 2017 June 27 10:27:14 »
If you have broad-band filters that do not overlap, then the OIII goes into the color of the filter that covers the wavelength of the OIII emission line (500.7 nm as the primary line). It is being registered by the broad-band filter that covers this wavelength...as the equations assume. If more both the blue and green broad-band filters cover the primary line (and, perhaps the secondary line as well), then the unmixing of intensity sources is not so simple and not really appropriate for the equations I presented. Unfortunately, 500.7 nm lies smack-dab between green and blue for Astrodon true balance filters. I suspect that people add the OIII to the green because the secondary emission of OIII is slightly greener than the primary...but still in the gap. So what you do is dictated by the filters you have and the color effect you want, especially if you decide to try to unmix intensity sources using my equations.

Alex

Offline mmirot

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #16 on: 2017 June 27 15:20:44 »

The 501 nm area would have an natural aqua/ cyan color.

Most RGB filters sets intentionally cross the OIII between G and B. When balanced this give aqua/cyan.

You method would have to be changed to apply it 50/50.

Offline aworonow

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #17 on: 2017 June 27 16:40:48 »
I fact, if both the blue and the green receive the full blast of OIII emission, then one should assume 100 contribution to each and treat each accordingly.
alex

Offline mmirot

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #18 on: 2017 June 29 12:24:17 »
Thanks 8)

Offline Niall Saunders

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #19 on: 2017 June 29 17:14:28 »
Surely the final outcome depends entirely on what the PixInsight user feels happiest with?

The human eye cannot make all of these colour distinctions in the first place, with our retinae not having been blessed with narrow-band filters. So, whatever final outcome and colour-mix you might choose, in this case you very much get the chance to play the hand of a greater Deity.

Yes, you are perhaps trying to approximate what you believe a 'bionic' eye might perceive, but you have to just go with what you are happiest with.

Perhaps what we need, for narrow-band images, is a Process that  gives us three (or even more?) slider-controls, each of wjich is 'tied' to a narrow-band image that we would like to incorporate into an existing (or new) 3-channel 'colour' image. The sliders, moving left and right, would represent 'where' in the colour spectrum (i.e. at which wavelength, in nm) the images should be placed. Along with each 'centre frequency' that the main slider would control, there could be a second control (or pair of controls) that would define the lower- and upper- 'sidebands' of this centre frequency - i.e. they would convey a bandwidth, or passband, for the narrow-band image that is to be incorporated.

With this Processing Tool, and a real-time preview of the final image being built, the colour mixing could be a very dynamic process. It could even help with the colour blending of RGB images - allowing RGB filter sets to be characterised and correctly mixed (even for OSC cameras).

But, maybe (I don't know) I am just missing some vital point. Has anybody ever tried something along these lines?
Cheers,
Niall Saunders
Clinterty Observatories
Aberdeen, UK

Altair Astro GSO 10" f/8 Ritchey Chrétien CF OTA on EQ8 mount with homebrew 3D Balance and Pier
Moonfish ED80 APO & Celestron Omni XLT 120
QHY10 CCD & QHY5L-II Colour
9mm TS-OAG and Meade DSI-IIC

Offline aworonow

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #20 on: 2017 June 29 18:49:22 »
Naill,
  I do believe you are missing one important point. Separating background red from the emission line red separates two different physical process and allows one to depict the areal distribution of each as well as their spatial intensity variability. In order to do that meaningfully, certain ground rules must be honored.
  If you do not care to place these qualities in your objective function, you are certainly free to make up any objective function that pleases you, including one as simple as "looks good to me." If we all had to play by a single set of rules, we would never have the wonder that is worm painting!

cheers,
Alex

Offline Niall Saunders

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #21 on: 2017 June 29 19:02:22 »
Hi Alex,

Quote
certain ground rules must be honored

I don't disagree - but these rules must then be fully and clearly defined. Don't you agree?

Quote
Separating background red from the emission line red separates two different physical process and allows one to depict the areal distribution of each as well as their spatial intensity variability

I haven't got my head round that statement at all (so far - it is 3am, and I have been at this infernal machine for 16 hours now)  :-[
Cheers,
Niall Saunders
Clinterty Observatories
Aberdeen, UK

Altair Astro GSO 10" f/8 Ritchey Chrétien CF OTA on EQ8 mount with homebrew 3D Balance and Pier
Moonfish ED80 APO & Celestron Omni XLT 120
QHY10 CCD & QHY5L-II Colour
9mm TS-OAG and Meade DSI-IIC

Offline akulapanam

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Re: Blending Ha with Red...a new approach
« Reply #22 on: 2017 July 01 12:54:28 »
The method you use also needs to account for the Hb emission as well IMHO.  It would be interesting compare a series of Ha / Hb shots.