Author Topic: where to start ???  (Read 6390 times)

Offline dhalliday

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where to start ???
« on: 2009 April 01 18:04:32 »
Hi folks... I am lost and need advice !!
I am new to this software, and feeling a bit overwhelmed,and like "did I just blow 400$" ???  (I doubt it...)
I image with a DSLR (modded) and stack in DSS (which I find quite confusing)
I guess my question is could someone take a few minutes to suggest where I should start to learn this software,advice on resource sites etc..
I am glad to see a "list" of Emoticons...because I am feeling most of them right about now :?
I need an"urgent" piece of advice about whether to abandon DSS for starters....I feel like I am driving a Ferrari but can't figure out the buttons !!
I might add that I mostly try to image with narrow band filter to battle lite pollution ++++

Dave Halliday
Dave Halliday
8" Newtonian/Vixen VC200L/ TV 101,etc etc
SSAG/EQ6
CGE Pro
SBIG ST2K,ST10XME

Offline Juan Conejero

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where to start ???
« Reply #1 on: 2009 April 02 02:19:01 »
Hi Dave,

Welcome to PixInsight Forum!

Yeah, you're sitted in a F430 Scuderia. Just don't give it too much gas for now and everything will be fine :)

The first thing I want to say is that I firmly stick up for DeepSkyStacker. It is an extremely efficient and easy-to-use software package to calibrate your images. I recommend it without a doubt.

To start using PixInsight, take a look at these video tutorials:

http://pixinsight.com/videos/DBE_M42_Example/en.html

They describe a complete processing work and will help you to get your feet wet (and keep them on the ground) with image processing in PixInsight.

There are a number of tutorials and processing examples. Some are advanced, some are very advanced, and then other are introductory. I recommend you to start with these:

http://pixinsight.com/examples/intro/dbosch-ha/en.html

http://pixinsight.com/examples/M45-sonnenstein/en.html

Of course, this forum is the best place to get help and discuss everything about PixInsight. I am a lucky guy to have so many fine folks here.

We are right now working like crazy to finish new version 1.5 of PixInsight. This is a major version with a lot of improvements and some new important tools, in which we are investing almost all of our resources. Once we release it, we have a lot of video tutorials planned. Video tutorials are the best learning resources and we are betting strong on them.

Astrophotography, and especially image processing, requires patience above anything else. You'll never get too much of that, actually. Don't be in a hurry; try to learn step by step. First the basic elements (image formats, histograms, image statistics, ...), then more and more advanced things, in growing order of complexity. Don't try to apply all processing tools the first time. You'll be surprised with what can be achieved with a simple histogram stretch and a couple simple expressions applied with PixelMath.

The pre-processing part is extremely important, so you'd better dedicate time and effort learning to use DSS. As any (nontrivial) software package, it has a learning curve, that can't be avoided. If your images aren't calibrated well, your chances to post-process them reduce drastically. From my experience, an overwhelmingly large number of failure stories in astrophotography are due to bad image calibration.

PixInsight isn't an easy-to-use application. Neither it is intended to be such. Our goal is to provide the most powerful and versatile image processing platform. With PixInsight, you gain full control on everything you do with your images. Of course, having the control means assuming the responsibility. But without having the control there is no fun, just as driving a F430 :D

You'll find substantial differences between PixInsight's graphical user interface and other imaging applications. This is just because PixInsight uses different (better, in our opinion) paradigms. Once you acquaint yourself with the PixInsight way, you'll see that working with PixInsight is easy and fun. Just be patient --with yourself, mainly--, that's all.
Juan Conejero
PixInsight Development Team
http://pixinsight.com/

Offline bitli

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where to start ???
« Reply #2 on: 2009 April 02 03:13:46 »
Hi Dave,

I went (and I am still going) through the beginners stage not long ago.  Using DSS and PI.

For DSS there is a yahoo group where you can get help. The first things to do is to forget the last step of DSS (the image enhancement or so).  It doesn't work. Just save the stacked image as is and process it with PI. Otherwise letting DSS use the proposed defaults usually results in an perfectly usable stacked image. It pays to read the help and process one image following the step by step explanation, then it will be clear and easy.

I have nothing to add to the PI recommendations, except that I tend to keep some notes of what I do, otherwise at the end of the evening I cant remember which steps I used and how.  With the script editor you can open a text file to take your note, this is handy as PI tends to have the full screen for itself, so switching to another program is not very practical. There is a process history feature, but it may be difficult for beginners, especially if you tray many things on different images.

The first thing to learn is STF, so that you can see something. This is well explained in the various videos. Following the videos is a must, just trying PI around at random wont let you very far, as it works quit differently than a programs like photoshop.

Have fun.
Bitli

Offline Jack Harvey

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« Reply #3 on: 2009 April 02 06:34:50 »
One application that can be helpful to beginners is to use TeamViewer.  This application allow two or more people to vew one of the participants desktop.  So one of the participants could open PixInsight with some data and the two or three participants can work together on learning the program.  TeamViewer is free and a very stable and reliable app that even allows cross platform work (both Mac and WIndows).  Does not allow voice but does have chat.  You could use Skype for comms.
Jack Harvey, PTeam Member
Team Leader, SSRO/PROMPT Imaging Team, CTIO

Offline dhalliday

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where to start ???
« Reply #4 on: 2009 April 02 14:43:52 »
Thanks folks for replying to my previous questions,I am calmer already....I feel a good vibe coming out of this organization,and that is exciting :lol:

I am also excited at being able to use the Emoticons,because as a computer idiot,well, its something I never figured out and now here they are on a tray beside me......

Seriously though, in my (very) initial use of this, software I am struck by how long some of the "transformations"  can take !!!
As I have said I am a computer idiot... I use a 1 yr old laptop which apparently has(don't laugh as I look in "system")    ??Intel core Duo CPU T5750  2 GHz, 3GB RAM/32 bit....(whatever all that is....)

Is this adequate,good,OK,could be better...?
I was chatting with my local vendor (trying to not look a total fool) and he says (used) computers with "very good" processing systems come up for sale now and again...sought after by musicians and photographers..
Is such an upgrade a good idea? a waste of time ?  entirely not neccesary ?
I would be happy to spend some $$ (I am not poor,but no Bernie Madoff..) but if its only going to cut 5-10 % off time wise I guess its a dumb idea..
Could someone give me a sense on this ? Keep in mind I am not too savvy on this stuff.

I would probably prefer a new eyepiece or something
 
thanks
Dave
Dave Halliday
8" Newtonian/Vixen VC200L/ TV 101,etc etc
SSAG/EQ6
CGE Pro
SBIG ST2K,ST10XME

Offline georg.viehoever

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where to start ???
« Reply #5 on: 2009 April 02 14:51:05 »
Hi Dave,

I am using DSS and Pixinsight since a year or so, and I am quite happy with them. Both have a learning curve, both have their share of quirks, and especially with Pixinsight I am still learning (with DSS I have found my way). But the results that I am getting now are much much better than what I got a year ago.

I saw your messages on the DSS mail list. You will need quite a lot of time to get good results from both tools, and even more time to get excellent results. But I have no doubt that you have chosen some of the best tools around for Deep Sky imaging. Just give yourself the time to grow with the tools.

All the best,

Georg
Georg (6 inch Newton, unmodified Canon EOS40D+80D, unguided EQ5 mount)

Offline Juan Conejero

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where to start ???
« Reply #6 on: 2009 April 03 08:48:39 »
Dave,

Quote
Intel core Duo CPU T5750 2 GHz, 3GB RAM/32 bit


That's a nice machine for image processing. PixInsight will run fine on it as well as DeepSkyStacker. I'd go for the eyepiece ;)
Juan Conejero
PixInsight Development Team
http://pixinsight.com/

Offline mmirot

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where to start ???
« Reply #7 on: 2009 April 03 11:47:01 »
Your CPU is fine .
A good external mointor is a must.
My laptop processes images fine but the screen stinks.
Laptop LCD's illumination are positional and they are therefoe impossible to calibrate.

Your cpu performance will be greatly inhanced by going to 64 bit a windows system.
Most people don't like change OS after having a cpu for  a while.
I spent a lot time installing and configuring mine going from 32 bit to 64 bit.  
It was worth it.


Max